Book People Archive

Re: Book Prices & Inflation

This post is a bit late. I haven't had much time for, or interest in, 
mailing lists this year. In fact, before my two recent posts on book 
prices, the last time I'd posted a message to this list was back on 
Jan 6th.

[Moderator: This forward is a bit late as well; sorry about that.  Earlier,
 I'd decided not to forward it, thinking that this threadlet had basically
 run its course.  But seeing as I'm winding things up here, I'll give
 folks some more opportunity to wind up their arguments as well.  If folks
 want to continue them beyond the tenure of this list, they can feel free
 to add pointers to other forums.  - JMO]
 


While catching up with the posts from the past few weeks, three in 
particular caught my eye:

On Oct. 10th, Michael Hart wrote this:

"Typesetters' Salaries"
http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/bparchive?year=2007&post=2007-10-10,5


> Did anyone notice the error about typesetters' salary
> levels and the median national income/poverty line?
> 
> When Mr. Noring's comment was simply
> 
> "*smile*"
> 
> My own reply contained an equally simple
> 
> "*blush*"
> 
> How embarrassing!
> 
> 
> Perhaps I should repeat my query as to whether anyone
> here needs me to point out such things, or it is more
> than obvious how they are being misused
> 
> ???
> 
> I did comment on this earlier, but it was censored. 


Then on Oct. 23rd, in reply to a post by Rod Hay, Michael wrote this:

"Re: Book Prices & Inflation"
http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/bparchive?year=2007&post=2007-10-23,3


> Isn't be [sic] cost listing below contradicted by the statements
> by and about the editors, typesetters, etc., that none are
> getting much above The Median National Income?
> 
> By the way, it would appear that not one reader has had an
> insight into Jon Norning's [sic] previous statement about this.


The next day, after Kent Larsen asked him, "What statement of Jon's 
are you referring to?" Michael wrote this:

"Re: Book Prices & Inflation"
http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/bparchive?year=2007&post=2007-10-24,4


> My apologies, I have not kept exact track of which of
> my replies got censoried [sic] by our moderator, and it may
> be that at least one of my previous references should
> not have been sent out.
> 
> The reference was to Mr. Noring's reply to the salary
> of Typesetters. . .something I recall as being around
> $32,600. . .but that's just a recollection, don't say
> that is an exact figure.
> 
> Mr. Noring's reply was that this was below the median
> national income, as I recall.
> 
> Further information on income statistics on request.


Your "recall" leaves much to be desired. Why don't we see what Jon 
Noring actually wrote?


"Subject: Re: More On Book Price Inflation"
Date: Thu, 4 Oct 2007 15:03:47 -0600
http://onlinebooks.library.upenn.edu/webbin/bparchive?year=2007&post=2007-10-04,5


> Michael Hart wrote:

[snip]

>> The average typesetter today makes about $32,500.
> 
> *smile*
> 
> A family making $32,500 per year is just above the poverty line.


Note that Jon referred to "a family" making that much money, not an 
individual. Of course, Jon's statement wasn't very precise. As we all 
know, families come in many different sizes. Now, if he'd said, "Some 
large families making $32,500 per year are just above the poverty 
line," he would have been undoubtedly correct. Indeed, some large 
families making only $32,500 per year are *below* the poverty line.

Let's take a look at the U.S. Census Bureau's latest poverty thresholds:

Poverty Thresholds 2006
http://www.census.gov/hhes/www/poverty/threshld/thresh06.html

That's a large table, so I won't copy all the rows and columns here.


                                   Related children under 18 years  	
     	  		
Size of family unit  Weighted
                       average    None    One     Two    Three    Four
                     thresholds
   	 	  	  	  	  	  	  	  	
Five people            24,382   25,076  25,441  24,662  24,059  23,691
Six people             27,560   28,842  28,957  28,360  27,788  26,938
Seven people           31,205   33,187  33,394  32,680  32,182  31,254
Eight people           34,774   37,117  37,444  36,770  36,180  35,342
Nine people or more    41,499   44,649  44,865  44,269  43,768  42,945


As you can see, some large families making only $32,500 per year *are* 
just above the poverty line, and some are indeed below it.

You know, Michael, the next time you decide to go on about someone's 
"error," for starters you might want to quote what the person actually 
said, not give some distorted version of it, and, of course, you might 
want to be sure of your facts. :)


Jose Menendez


P.S. Anyone who's curious about how many families in the U.S.--large 
and small--are living in poverty can check this table from the Census 
Bureau:

POV37: Families in Poverty by Size of Family and Number of Related 
Children: 2006
http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032007/pov/new37_000.htm