Book People Archive

!@!!@[redacted] on metadata

On Tue, 16 May 2006 Bowerbird@[redacted] wrote:

> one of the most amusing aspects of the cyberlibrary discussion
> these days is the importance some people put on "metadata"...
>
> even michael hart has said that he thinks many librarians have
> declined to include project gutenberg texts in their collections
> because "it doesn't have marc data".   while i believe that he has
> been _told_ that, i think that's clearly an "excuse", not a "reason".

I must agree on this, as we made a dededicated effort for 18 months now
that send MARC records to all who had express interested, and not one of
these has told me that this got even ONE eBook into their collections.

This out of 34 librarians who subscribed to the MARC records project.

I how have a message out to them asking to confirm if any results,
in addition to similar previous requests, but nothing so far.

So I must agree that they are hiding behind the MARC requests,
not that I will stop trying to overcome this.


> i think an emphasis on metadata is misguided, perhaps delusional.

I wouldn't go that far, even though I, personally, prefer just to
read a book, at least the first time, without knowing anything as
to when or where it was written, or about the author.

I prefer not to judge a book by its metadata.


> i'm not saying that metadata -- and various other types of cataloging
> information -- will become totally useless, but i think it will fade greatly
> as we move the cyberlibrary from being physical-item-based to digital...

Actually, for those who LIKE such data, I think it will do just the opposite,
and that for them, catalogues will gain ground rather than fade.


> i think the means we've come to utilize for locating content on the web
> indicates how we will operate in a universal digital informational milieu,
> including books, and let's face it, google looks nothing like a card catalog.

True, you CAN dodge the catalogues with search engines, and those who want to,
will be happier than ever, but so will those who like the catalogues.


> when you can search the entirety of a book -- because it is text and that
> text is digital -- the amount of information you have (and can generate)
> about that text is infinitely richer than the fairly simple "metadata" that
> is typically generated.

True, but that doesn't tell you much about the author, publisher, location
of either, or of the place the book takes place, etc., or about the limits
on publication at the time. . . .

These CAN be very important data.


> for its weight, metadata was historically cost-effective, since even knowing 
> the general "subject or topic" or a book can be quite useful in helping us to
 
> categorize it.  but again, against the fullness that can be amassed by 
> thorough analysis of a book's actual contents guided by an inquiry conducted 
> by the actual person knowing exactly what they want, the general "subject or 
> topic" will certainly pale to relative insignificance...

True, the CONTENT of the book is the real significance, and the metadata
is perhaps only the cherry on top, for for some that is the best part.


> once extensive "social tagging" is applied throughout the cyberlibrary,
> and collaborative filtering means that we can stand in front of a digital
> "bookshelf" and have particular titles that will appeal to us _individually_
> actually _radiate_a_glow_ that says "pick me, you'll be glad you read me,
> pick me!", the card-catalog of old will seem extremely primitive indeed...

Again, only for some. . .but who knows. . ."networking" of this nature,
such as a REAL example of "if you liked this book perhaps you will want
to read this other book" will take on a greater meaning than that of a
robotic salesperson at a bookstore. . . .


> anyway, the mentality of many librarians seems hopelessly stuck in the past,
> but it's encouraging when some of the brighter lights seem to get a clue, so

The funny part is that I keep hearing from librarians that I never heard from
ever before saying that they have included Project Gutenberg in the catalog--
but the ones I try to help do this, never seem to get around to it. . . .

Go figure, eh?

Perhaps Mr. Bird is right, and it's all just an "excuse" to waste my time.



Thanks!!!

Give the world eBooks in 2006!!!

Michael S. Hart
Founder
Project Gutenberg

Blog at http://hart.pglaf.org